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re: Honest discussion about NIL. Would love to hear thoughts.
Posted on 4/24/24 at 11:10 am to twk
Posted on 4/24/24 at 11:10 am to twk
quote:
Collective bargaining will not solve the NIL problem.
Neither will State Rights. As quickly as the court system opened this can of worms, the States have been busying themselves trying to create advantages in their version of NIL. There are no real advantages to unregulated greed, just more chaos.
Tennessee and Virginia are 2 of the latest trying to reinvent NIL for personal gain. Others will simply follow suit if they perceive an advantage. Unregulated greed through State Rights is not the business model I would recommend for long-term stability in college sports.
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Posted on 4/24/24 at 11:20 am to bamameister
quote:Alabama is in session right now; I'm hoping someone in Montgomery has the sense to bring an NIL law like Virginia passed last week to the table before the session soon ends. Virginia colleges were granted freedom to administer NIL benefits to athletes and permits state colleges and universities to create and negotiate NIL deals without NCAA input or restrictions.
Tennessee and Virginia are 2 of the latest trying to reinvent NIL for personal gain. Others will simply follow suit if they perceive an advantage. Unregulated greed through State Rights is not the business model I would recommend for long-term stability in college sports.
Get on the ball Governor Memaw, sign this legislation into law!
Posted on 4/24/24 at 11:34 am to RT1941
Posted on 4/24/24 at 11:39 am to kywildcatfanone
I hate it. Even if Jerry and John give ark 100 mill a yr. Pay the kids but shite they can't make more then nba draft picks
Posted on 4/24/24 at 11:42 am to Smoke Test
quote:The NFL system is transparent and dependent on open books and access to contracts, so the NFL system works because there is no real mechanism for "cheating" the system.
The schools just hate revenue sharing. It costs them money. It’s the only way out though. Share revenue, collectively bargain, sign contracts. Works in the NFL.
Oh. It was never NIL. It’s been pay for play the whole time.
Skirting the rules for sign stealing, coaching hires, and inducing players to ask for trades are dealt with rather than ignored, with significant penalties.
Pity the fool that tries to skirt the salary cap and gets busted.
The Antitrust issues with the NFL have been molded over a long period of time, though numerous legal precedents, and are continuously scrutinized by public, private and governmental organizations at many levels.
The NFL system won't work for college.
Private schools don't share their information, while the public schools are subject to open records access.
The notion of collective bargaining and salary caps is a joke. The rampant cheating that existed in the past would just be business as usual, with under the table deals the norm rather than the exception.
Revenue sharing, by definition, means the schools share/pay for everything,
Why should every school pay the same % revenue or the same $/year?
That is not fair, or equitable for the schools. Every school chooses what is best for them, to build or not build better facilities, including food options and amenities, suites and private boxes, scheduling of out of conference opponents, ticket prices, cost and quality of merchandise, etc.
The bigger, better programs would generate more revenue, have more to share, and theoretically get better because they have more to spend. The only difference is the schools pay for it rather than the collectives, alumni groups, associations, NIL partners, etc.
Now, each conference or entity negotiates their own media contracts, with the built in inequalities. Big difference compared to the NFL.
Transfer rules need some benchmarks, but the college football world needs a unified position that would meet antitrust guidelines. Sending some jake-leg state delegation to lobby congress is not the right way.
The Title IX congressional hearings ended with a Federal mandate for compliance, under the purview of the NCAA. Since then, college football has systematically neutered the NCAA, and now some are looking for the NCAA to bail them out, with government oversight. Be careful what you ask for.
The system has always been tilted, its just tilted in a different direction right now.
Posted on 4/24/24 at 11:56 am to kywildcatfanone
quote:
Wouldn't it have been better to have there been a cap that applies to all schools and all sports of a certain amount, and everyone gets the same? That would make the incentive to chase the most money go away, and kids could go to the schools they want and not just choose based upon pay.
It’s not feasible. Schools are not paying players ergo a cap on them wouldn’t work. What you are suggesting is capping private individuals and businesses or limiting what players can earn from businesses and private individuals.
A better model to do this would be for players to be employees of the collegiate football league. That removes the schools and puts the financial burden on the league. That also creates super conferences as the league would need oversight on standards, scheduling, eligibility, and transfers.
That’s the next logical step in this mess. Schools recruit kids and they sign over the limited NIL rights to the league. They could still get endorsement deals (NIL deals) locally but the league would have oversight on them, thus curtailing them greatly. It would remove the inducement to chase the dollar as they would get a base pay plus endorsements.
Posted on 4/24/24 at 1:02 pm to Smokeyone
quote:The "league" would also need to place stiff restrictions on transfers. i.e. an athlete becomes eligible for transfer once they've completed their sophomore year with the requisite credit hours.
It’s not feasible. Schools are not paying players ergo a cap on them wouldn’t work. What you are suggesting is capping private individuals and businesses or limiting what players can earn from businesses and private individuals.
A better model to do this would be for players to be employees of the collegiate football league. That removes the schools and puts the financial burden on the league. That also creates super conferences as the league would need oversight on standards, scheduling, eligibility, and transfers.
That’s the next logical step in this mess. Schools recruit kids and they sign over the limited NIL rights to the league. They could still get endorsement deals (NIL deals) locally but the league would have oversight on them, thus curtailing them greatly. It would remove the inducement to chase the dollar as they would get a base pay plus endorsements.
Posted on 4/24/24 at 1:16 pm to RT1941
quote:
The "league" would also need to place stiff restrictions on transfers.
Removing the dollar chasing would greatly reduce the transfers. Maybe bonus for GPA and a degree from member institutions would help.
Posted on 4/24/24 at 1:47 pm to kywildcatfanone
He who has the most gold!
And its not often that I agree with anything Nick Sabin says but I agree with him that NIL will forever change the landscape of college football.
And its not often that I agree with anything Nick Sabin says but I agree with him that NIL will forever change the landscape of college football.
Posted on 4/24/24 at 1:52 pm to kywildcatfanone
There is a simpler way to regulate the craziness. Forget about the entire NIL deals. NCAA cannot regulate what an adult can earn. Nor should it. NCAA already screwed this pooch when they profited off of they sold the NIL of the athletes.
What the NCAA can do is establish a uniform set of standards for admission and transfers for athletes. 2.5 GPA in the high school core classes…maintain a minimum of an 2.0 to remain in any athletic program with a minimum of 12 hours per semester… a 2.5 GPA with a minimum of 24 hours to transfer. Allow a one time transfer…redshirt one year after transfer. Do not allow any school to be involved in any NIL deal.
The advantages are great. Alabama took advantage of no minimum requirements forever to stockpile athletic idiots. Most of the 2022 Aggie class are no longer in Div 1 football, and wouldn’t be with a team anyway due to grades or class attendance. Same with LSU. Most of Lane Kiflin’s mercenaries would be out of football this year. Big money donors will be much more selective in throwing around NIL money to someone that might not be on the team next semester. The transfer ‘hos will find it easier to remain at the original school rather than transferring. The Wild West mentality of the transfer portal will be changed. BMDs will be much more selective and restrictive on terms with kids, families and agents. A couple of years of getting burned on NIL contracts with a kid that flunked out or can’t transfer or play, will bring the money idiots to heel.
The market will settle itself down for the NIL deals.
What the NCAA can do is establish a uniform set of standards for admission and transfers for athletes. 2.5 GPA in the high school core classes…maintain a minimum of an 2.0 to remain in any athletic program with a minimum of 12 hours per semester… a 2.5 GPA with a minimum of 24 hours to transfer. Allow a one time transfer…redshirt one year after transfer. Do not allow any school to be involved in any NIL deal.
The advantages are great. Alabama took advantage of no minimum requirements forever to stockpile athletic idiots. Most of the 2022 Aggie class are no longer in Div 1 football, and wouldn’t be with a team anyway due to grades or class attendance. Same with LSU. Most of Lane Kiflin’s mercenaries would be out of football this year. Big money donors will be much more selective in throwing around NIL money to someone that might not be on the team next semester. The transfer ‘hos will find it easier to remain at the original school rather than transferring. The Wild West mentality of the transfer portal will be changed. BMDs will be much more selective and restrictive on terms with kids, families and agents. A couple of years of getting burned on NIL contracts with a kid that flunked out or can’t transfer or play, will bring the money idiots to heel.
The market will settle itself down for the NIL deals.
Posted on 4/24/24 at 2:15 pm to kywildcatfanone
I think everybody talking like transfers are something that can be controlled have gotten lost in the NIL forest and perhaps not seen that the very same dynamics are at play there as well. There's not going to be any control transfers for all of the same fundamental reasons.
And I don't see any way any union can function either. They offer nothing to either side, students or schools.
And I don't see any way any union can function either. They offer nothing to either side, students or schools.
Posted on 4/24/24 at 2:33 pm to Smoke Test
quote:
The schools just hate revenue sharing. It costs them money. It’s the only way out though. Share revenue, collectively bargain, sign contracts. Works in the NFL.
Oh. It was never NIL. It’s been pay for play the whole time.
My you rot in h3ll Ed O’bannon.
There is no revenue to share unless you want to take it away from all the other sports because there are only 1 or 2 sports that draw income.
You'll be removing the scholarships of thousands and thousands of kids across the country, screwing over 99% of NCAA athletes for the benefit of less than 1% of them.
Because all the money that is earned is put back into the program itself as well as other sports. In exchange, they are given an education worth probably 6 figures or close to it. Top Notch medical care. About 25k a year in cash, housing, food and in many schools coaching and a support staff to help them launch a career in the NFL.
It's 100% voluntary and if someones was to try and spend their own money to get these kinds of benefits, they'd be looking at spending probably between 500k to $1 million or more depending on the quality of training and mentoring they bought. Most of them down there at Rex Kwon Do and Football facility.
The NFL doesn't want them, and they have no draw to viewers unless they are playing for their school. Other leagues try to start up, offer no fricking support, no housing, no real training, and pay their players around 50k a year in taxable money, so around say 40k take home. When they get about 25k in cash before taking the rest into account.
What needs to be done is for the government to butt the frick out of it, and the schools tell the kids - you can take it or leave it. Nobody is forcing them to go, there are thousands of kids out there who would love for the schools to "take advantage of them" in their place.
frick entitlement society.
Posted on 4/24/24 at 2:47 pm to Gunga Din
quote:
This was the way it was presented to the public.
Nobody was told that there would be "collectives"...
Nobody was told that guys basketball transfers would be lending their "name, image and likeness" to the owner of the Dallas Cowboys.
What's everybody whining about. A month ago we were told it's just Saban whining. Remember?
The truth is, Saban tried to warn everyone. Honestly, anybody with half a brain knew what was going to happen but pea brained individuals thought it better to rip Saban instead of getting behind his actions. The narrative around the county (especially on this site) was, oh Bama just doesn't want to lose their advantage so don't bitch and complain now. Everyone obviously got what they wanted. Again, stop whining.
Posted on 4/24/24 at 2:49 pm to 3down10
quote:
frick entitlement society.
Yeah how fricking dare someone be able to make money in a capitalist society.
I’m glad there’s someone like 3down10 who is perfectly fine making minimum wage and never asking for a raise.
Posted on 4/24/24 at 2:56 pm to pankReb
quote:
Yeah how fricking dare someone be able to make money in a capitalist society.
I’m glad there’s someone like 3down10 who is perfectly fine making minimum wage and never asking for a raise.
Nobody is preventing them from making money. In fact, they are treated quite well in benefits and cash(legal cash).
And I've never gone to the government to demand a company give me a raise, nor would it ever in a million years be a proper function of the government to get involved. If they won't pay me what I'm worth, someone else will. If nobody is going to pay me more, then obviously I am not worth more. It's called REALITY. If you broke my salary down into hours worked, I make 4 figures per hour.
It's 100% voluntary. If they can get a better deal elsewhere, then they are free to choose so. If you think they have that much value, start your own league and pay them.
Just gonna frick people over because you believe stupid shite.
This post was edited on 4/24/24 at 3:01 pm
Posted on 4/24/24 at 2:59 pm to Jster15
quote:
Alabama took advantage of no minimum requirements forever to stockpile athletic idiots.
Wrong. Bama followed the guidelines set by the NCAA member institutions. The member schools haven't been allowed to admit at their own free will since 1972 when the 1.6 rule came out requiring certain GPA's. . The NCAA then upped minimum requirements in 1983 with Proposition 48 which meant you could only take student athletes who completed "core" cirriculum in line with fields of majors, had a minimum GPA in those classes and maintained a minimum GPA of 2.0 while at the university.
Here's the documentation if you'd like to read it for yourself and become more versed in what you are talking about.
LINK /
Posted on 4/24/24 at 3:01 pm to 3down10
quote:
Nobody is preventing them from making money.
Could they go get a side job? Yes or no
quote:
And I've never gone to the government to demand a company give me a raise,
That’s because you were never restricted by a governing body on how much money you could make off of yourself.
Sorry you hate capitalism so much. Maybe go to North Korea if you’re such a big fan of salary limitations.
quote:
If you think they have that much value, start your own league and pay them.
Instead of crying so hard about people being able to profit off of their abilities, maybe you should start your own league and refuse to pay people.
This post was edited on 4/24/24 at 3:04 pm
Posted on 4/24/24 at 3:06 pm to kywildcatfanone
What do you guys think about "open dorse"? You going to invite any athletes too your barbecue
https://opendorse.com/
https://opendorse.com/
Posted on 4/24/24 at 3:11 pm to pankReb
quote:
Could they go get a side job? Yes or no
No, someone can start a different league or whatever and pay them. Or they can choose not to go to college at all. Being a football player is 100% optional, nobody forces them to do it. They are not brought in with chains around their ankles. They are choosing to play college sports because it's a fricking great opportunity that most kids would love a chance to get and I'm not going to sit around and pretend like it's not.
quote:
That’s because you were never restricted by a governing body on how much money you could make off of yourself.
Sorry you hate capitalism so much. Maybe go to North Korea if you’re such a big fan of salary limitations.
Because I'm an American citizen and I can just change jobs. The idea that the government should regulate a business/orginzation is not capitalism, it's North Korea shite.
In a capitalist society, organizations are perfectly able to come to together and make a set of rules to which they all agree with in order to create a product/service. The idea that people and such should not be allowed to enter into such agreements and must be regulated by the government is again, North Korea shite.
If they don't want to play footbal, they don't have to. Just like nobody forced you to work at Subway, McDonalds, join the military(most of the time) or anywhere else where you pay is decided by the people who hired you, not the fricking employee.
Posted on 4/24/24 at 3:14 pm to pankReb
quote:
Instead of crying so hard about people being able to profit off of their abilities, maybe you should start your own league and refuse to pay people.
They are profiting on their abilities. You're just too dumb to see it and too entitled to recognize the value of what they are being given and why they take all the other options in life.
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