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re: The media and casual fans narrative around the 3-3-5 defense?
Posted on 1/7/23 at 4:44 pm to td01241
Posted on 1/7/23 at 4:44 pm to td01241
quote:
In fact most SEC and big time schools run a variation of this defense a good amount and it’s where the Star position essentially came from.
Miss State is the only SEC school that runs this in the truest sense. The closest thing that is common in the SEC is a 4-2-5 where both the edge defensive lineman are actually outside backers.
It’s a very different system for your lineman to go against in terms of identifying pressures. Michigan, who also runs a lot of 11 and 12 personnel and has a good offensive line, let guys run free into the backfield multiple times because they didn’t identify the rushers.
The 3 safeties look also completely changes how you identify man or zone coverage. Against a Star, you can typically just motion a slot guy to read man or zone.
It’s not new at this point, but it is different from what every SEC defense other than Miss State runs.
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Posted on 1/7/23 at 4:48 pm to TomRollTideRitter
I’ve more or less addressed everything you said down thread already. I also never said teams like UGA and Bama run a 3-3-5 I said they utilize a variation of it through the star position which is true. Most importantly they’ve been doing it since at least the early 2000s and the 3-3-5 stack as TCU runs it dates back long before that. So, as you pointed out and is the purpose of the thread, it’s not in any way shape or form a new or innovative scheme and nothing TCU does within in (as far as I have seen) is either.
It’s also essentially their only card in the deck. They’re a one trick pony even if that trick is done relatively well. UGA (and others and I’m just using them because they are the matchup here) can go true 3-4, true nickel, true dime, star package which is the closest thing to a 3-3-5 or that 4-2-5 stack you mentioned with OLB as DE you mentioned also utilizing the star.
It’s also essentially their only card in the deck. They’re a one trick pony even if that trick is done relatively well. UGA (and others and I’m just using them because they are the matchup here) can go true 3-4, true nickel, true dime, star package which is the closest thing to a 3-3-5 or that 4-2-5 stack you mentioned with OLB as DE you mentioned also utilizing the star.
This post was edited on 1/7/23 at 4:55 pm
Posted on 1/7/23 at 4:50 pm to Marty Dawg
quote:
It's mainly because they are bored since the spread is 12.5 and there really aren't any other interesting narratives to push other than "David vs Goliath" etc.
This. Media is also trying to convince those of us that aren't UGA or TCU fans to watch by lying to us about TCU having a chance. The only chance TCU has is if UGA self-destructs which is possible but not probable.
Posted on 1/7/23 at 4:51 pm to multicampus
quote:
Presuming Washington is able to play,
He'll be in a brace but Washington will play.
Posted on 1/7/23 at 4:54 pm to VoxDawg
If Washington can do everything we usually ask him to do that’s amazing but we truly don’t need him for that in this game. If he can give us 25ish plays as a run blocker it’s more than enough.
Posted on 1/7/23 at 4:56 pm to td01241
No idea to be honest.
Posted on 1/7/23 at 5:03 pm to Prof
UGA self destructing is almost certainly not going to happen. Stetson has literal ice flowing in his veins and our o line has allowed like 1 sack in the past 6 or 7 games. To me this just screams as a game where Bowers absolutely eats for around 150 yds and 2 TD. Best TCU can hope for on the self destruction front similar to Mich is one classic Stet gunslinger retard interception which has for the most part completely vanished this season since he threw the Bama monkey off his back.
This post was edited on 1/7/23 at 5:04 pm
Posted on 1/7/23 at 5:07 pm to td01241
quote:
I also never said teams like UGA and Bama run a 3-3-5 I said they utilize a variation of it through the star position which is true
I don’t really consider the 4-2-5 / 2–4-5 that Bama and UGA run to be that similar to what TCU runs.
A 3-3-5 is easier to block from a size standpoint, but harder from a football IQ standpoint. Michigan had no success running the ball against TCU after the first play. The reason was Michigan kept misidentifying where the pressure was going to come from.
I think if TCU has any shot they’ll have to do the same thing, so why would the media not talk about a defensive formation that UGA has only faced once this season?
They can’t hardly say don’t tune in, UGA has better players. And it’d be dishonest to say that TCU’s down linemen have much chance of doing anything other than eating blocks to free up the backers and safeties coming down.
Posted on 1/7/23 at 5:13 pm to td01241
On its face, if Washington is healthy to be the lethal threat in the blocking game he is, Georgia should Feast on this front and pound the ball.
Of course; that’s just on its face. Execution has to be there. Same thing was being said about WVU’s 3-3-5 in the 2007 Fiesta Bowl against Oklahoma. Oklahoma couldn’t run for shite on them tho.
Of course; that’s just on its face. Execution has to be there. Same thing was being said about WVU’s 3-3-5 in the 2007 Fiesta Bowl against Oklahoma. Oklahoma couldn’t run for shite on them tho.
Posted on 1/7/23 at 5:13 pm to TomRollTideRitter
quote:
A 3-3-5 is easier to block from a size standpoint, but harder from a football IQ standpoint. Michigan had no success running the ball against TCU after the first play. The reason was Michigan kept misidentifying where the pressure was going to come from. I think if TCU has any shot they’ll have to do the same thing, so why would the media not talk about a defensive formation that UGA has only faced once this season? They can’t hardly say don’t tune in, UGA has better players. And it’d be dishonest to say that TCU’s down linemen have much chance of doing anything other than eating blocks to free up the backers and safeties coming down.
Ok so talk about all of that. Don’t talk about the 3-3-5 like it’s some out no where innovation though because it’s 100% not and there is a reason the top teams don’t use it nor does the NFL. It’s simply not as effective when going against top tier offensive fronts especially but skill positions as well which UGA has both of. UGAs oline and 11/12 personal also isn’t really comparable to MU as you did earlier they’re way better with at least 3 definite 1st rounders at LT and 2 at TE.
Posted on 1/7/23 at 5:16 pm to FireDanMullen
It’s not solely about being able to have a run game advantage. It’s also if not more about our ability to run any route package and have the full playbook open in 11 and 12 personal resulting in not having to sub which doesn’t allow TCU to match. In no way was or is MU able to anything similar and neither was OU in 2007.
Posted on 1/7/23 at 5:29 pm to TomRollTideRitter
UGA played MSU this year.
UGA has also known since the playoff matchups were announced that they had a 50% chance of playing TCU. Analysts have probably been studying film since then.
This isn't going to be like a short turnaround to play a triple option team.
UGA has also known since the playoff matchups were announced that they had a 50% chance of playing TCU. Analysts have probably been studying film since then.
This isn't going to be like a short turnaround to play a triple option team.
Posted on 1/7/23 at 5:38 pm to td01241
quote:
Yes because in their variation of 3-3-5, it’s most traditional and base alignment,2 of those 3 safeties and the strong side and Mike linebackers have to come immediately downhill like they’re shot out of a rocket and hope to sneak through gaps in the run game, which UGAs Oline (one of if not the best in the country) and our TE won’t allow.
They are going to be sending undersized LBs at guards.
It didn’t accomplish anything for Bama when Golding did it this year other than to send my blood pressure skyrocketing and help lose a few games and it’s gonna get TCU gashed in the run game when their 225lb LBs are put on roller skates by UGA’s interior OL.
Ohio State was a bad matchup for UGA, TCU is a good one.
Posted on 1/7/23 at 5:43 pm to td01241
Stare runs it, but suppose TCU is much faster and physical.. that’s not a dig MSU.. they’re just what the media claims!
I’ll be shocked if they are as fast as most the defenses in the SEC.
I’ll be shocked if they are as fast as most the defenses in the SEC.
Posted on 1/7/23 at 5:44 pm to tide06
They've been sending their LBs at Guards all season and just finished sending them at the Moore Award Oline from "smashfest" Michigan. They stuffed Michigan's run game all game long after that first play.
You know that lining up your DEs at the 4i keeps guards from just jumping down the 2nd level and mauling your backers......right?
You know that lining up your DEs at the 4i keeps guards from just jumping down the 2nd level and mauling your backers......right?
This post was edited on 1/7/23 at 5:46 pm
Posted on 1/7/23 at 5:47 pm to td01241
I have learned much in this thread. Thanks.
Posted on 1/7/23 at 5:58 pm to CharlotteSooner
Football games aren’t played in a vacuum. To point out the folly of your post
1) First and foremost Mi got down bad early due to them doing retard shite. This completely changed the complexion of the game and way TCUs defense and MIs offense would be called. It’s extremely foolish to act like the same thing will be replicated vs UGA, although anything theoretically is possible. Therefore analyzing the game as if it will is a moot point.
2) While UGA may not the have the single best G in the country they do almost undoubtedly have the best offensive front especially when factoring in TE. Bowers, Washington, and Jones will all be 1st rounders and most of the others will be drafted somewhere. MI also runs a very different type of offense from UGA even if they look similar on their face. MI couldn’t in their wildest dreams have the same play freedom UGA does in 11 and 12 personal
3) Mi was using a lot of zone blocking concepts from what I saw and remember but I have only watched the game once and I could be wrong here. I seriously doubt UGA will do this as it would likely be retarded.
1) First and foremost Mi got down bad early due to them doing retard shite. This completely changed the complexion of the game and way TCUs defense and MIs offense would be called. It’s extremely foolish to act like the same thing will be replicated vs UGA, although anything theoretically is possible. Therefore analyzing the game as if it will is a moot point.
2) While UGA may not the have the single best G in the country they do almost undoubtedly have the best offensive front especially when factoring in TE. Bowers, Washington, and Jones will all be 1st rounders and most of the others will be drafted somewhere. MI also runs a very different type of offense from UGA even if they look similar on their face. MI couldn’t in their wildest dreams have the same play freedom UGA does in 11 and 12 personal
3) Mi was using a lot of zone blocking concepts from what I saw and remember but I have only watched the game once and I could be wrong here. I seriously doubt UGA will do this as it would likely be retarded.
This post was edited on 1/7/23 at 6:04 pm
Posted on 1/7/23 at 6:03 pm to td01241
Sounds like you're the expert and you've got it all figured out.
What would I know? They just play in the BIG XII and I watch them all season long as opposed to you seeing them for the first time against Michigan.
What would I know? They just play in the BIG XII and I watch them all season long as opposed to you seeing them for the first time against Michigan.
Posted on 1/7/23 at 6:05 pm to CharlotteSooner
quote:
You know that lining up your DEs at the 4i keeps guards from just jumping down the 2nd level and mauling your backers......right?
That is why UGA runs the odd front as well.
I've read that TCU is closer to the Arkansas (Odom) defensive scheme than MSU (Arnett) scheme.
They will be very aggressive.
This is why (I know it blows people's minds) that UGA has played such a diverse offensive game script this season.
We were heavy zone blocking and RPO in the beginning of the Mizzou game.
A few weeks later, and our zone blocking game is on point and as good as our power game.
I expect heavy RPO against their aggressive defense.
Posted on 1/7/23 at 6:06 pm to CharlotteSooner
I am by no means an expert and didn’t play football myself past the HS level nor am I a coach. I do more or less know what I’m talking about from a concept perspective and how things are schemed and adapted in game situations. Since you chose not to make arguments against anything I said in regards to football concepts and blocking scheme I’ll assume you weren’t capable and either lack the knowledge or it’s a tacit acknowledgment I was correct.
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