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re: Alabama in top 3 sports
Posted on 3/28/16 at 2:06 pm to SummerOfGeorge
Posted on 3/28/16 at 2:06 pm to SummerOfGeorge
Total AP Top 10 Appearances
1. Kentucky (662)
23. Florida (139)
29. Arkansas (118)
33. Missouri (111)
36. Alabama (100)
41. Tennessee (93)
44. Vanderbilt (87)
47. LSU (78)
57. South Carolina (59)
62. Mississippi State (51)
66. Auburn (47)
86. Texas A&M (22)
133. Georgia (1)
133. Ole Miss (1)
1. Kentucky (662)
23. Florida (139)
29. Arkansas (118)
33. Missouri (111)
36. Alabama (100)
41. Tennessee (93)
44. Vanderbilt (87)
47. LSU (78)
57. South Carolina (59)
62. Mississippi State (51)
66. Auburn (47)
86. Texas A&M (22)
133. Georgia (1)
133. Ole Miss (1)
This post was edited on 3/28/16 at 2:07 pm
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Posted on 3/28/16 at 2:08 pm to SummerOfGeorge
quote:
Total AP Poll Appearances Basketball
1. Kentucky (859)
26. Alabama (293)
28. Missouri (288)
31. Arkansas (265)
32. Florida (264)
36. Tennessee (241)
43. Vanderbilt (204)
45. LSU (198)
55. Mississippi State (140)
64. South Carolina (124)
70. Texas A&M (105)
79. Auburn (90)
91. Georgia (66)
98. Ole Miss (49)
I had not realized how historically terrible UGA was in basketball. It takes effort to be worse than Auburn.
Posted on 3/28/16 at 2:08 pm to SummerOfGeorge
quote:
Total AP Top 10 Appearances
1. Kentucky (662)
23. Florida (139)
29. Arkansas (118)
33. Missouri (111)
36. Alabama (100)
41. Tennessee (93)
44. Vanderbilt (87)
47. LSU (78)
57. South Carolina (59)
62. Mississippi State (51)
66. Auburn (47)
86. Texas A&M (22)
133. Georgia (1)
133. Ole Miss (1)
top 10 finishes would probably be more appropriate IMO. But lol at Georgia. It's simply amazing to me at their success, or lack thereof, in basketball.
Posted on 3/28/16 at 2:09 pm to SummerOfGeorge
Top AP #1 Appearances
3. Kentucky (122)
19. Florida (14)
21. Arkansas (12)
30. Missouri (6)
46. Alabama (2)
51. South Carolina (1)
51. Tennessee (1)
Auburn, Georgia, Ole Miss, Mississippi State, LSU and Vanderbilt have 0 #1 appearances.
3. Kentucky (122)
19. Florida (14)
21. Arkansas (12)
30. Missouri (6)
46. Alabama (2)
51. South Carolina (1)
51. Tennessee (1)
Auburn, Georgia, Ole Miss, Mississippi State, LSU and Vanderbilt have 0 #1 appearances.
This post was edited on 3/28/16 at 2:10 pm
Posted on 3/28/16 at 2:10 pm to lsufball19
quote:
that's kind of a leap from what he's trying to say IMO. no one metric should be used, alone, to determine an all-time list. although, some metrics should have more weight than others, like postseason success
I don't think that's a leap at all. He has said more than once in this thread that all time wins don't matter - that the only thing they're good for is getting you to the post season, which is the only thing that matters.
If the only criteria we're using to judge programs is success in post season play, then my post is just as valid. It's silly to pretend that all time wins don't matter when looking at the historical success of sports programs.
Should all-time wins be the only measuring stick? Of course not. Are they meaningless? El Oh El.
Posted on 3/28/16 at 2:12 pm to lsufball19
quote:
top 10 finishes would probably be more appropriate IMO
Top 10 Finishes
1. Kentucky (42)
20. Arkansas (9)
33. Missouri (6)
43. Alabama (5)
43. LSU (5)
49. Florida (4)
49. Mississippi State (4)
49. South Carolina (4)
49. Vanderbilt (4)
76. Auburn (2)
76. Tennessee (2)
90. Texas A&M (1)
Georgia and Ole Miss have 0 Top 10 finishes.
This post was edited on 3/28/16 at 2:13 pm
Posted on 3/28/16 at 2:14 pm to Tuscaloosa
quote:
Also, UConn has a better basketball program historically than Kansas, and Florida basketball is on par with Michigan State.
Nope. Not at all. Not sure why you would try to put words in my mount about something when I've already posted by opinions about where all these programs rank within this very post.
Using a system ENTIRELY weighted on NCAA Tournament success, this is where those programs rnak all-time:
Kansas ranks #5
Michigan State ranks #8
UConn ranks #9
Florida ranks #26
Very few fans of basketball would disagree with those observations. But of course any true historian of basketball would know that its all about the NCAA tournament when it comes to college basketball.
UNLV ranks #4 in all-time basketball winning percentage.
Temple ranks #6 in all-time basketball total wins.
My rankings using only NCAA Tournament success ranks UNLV #30 all-time and Temple #32 all-time. Why because wins and winning percentage mean nothing if it hasn't translated in tournament success.
Posted on 3/28/16 at 2:15 pm to SummerOfGeorge
Total Top 25 Final Poll
1. Kentucky (49)
27. Arkansas (16)
31. Alabama (15)
35. Missouri (14)
37. Florida (13)
39. LSU (12)
42. Mississippi State (11)
42. Tennessee (11)
42. Vanderbilt (11)
58. South Carolina (8)
81. Auburn (5)
81. Georgia (5)
109. Ole Miss (2)
1. Kentucky (49)
27. Arkansas (16)
31. Alabama (15)
35. Missouri (14)
37. Florida (13)
39. LSU (12)
42. Mississippi State (11)
42. Tennessee (11)
42. Vanderbilt (11)
58. South Carolina (8)
81. Auburn (5)
81. Georgia (5)
109. Ole Miss (2)
This post was edited on 3/28/16 at 2:15 pm
Posted on 3/28/16 at 2:17 pm to SummerOfGeorge
So, Alabama ranks SEC-wise :
- 3rd Top 25 finishes (15)
- 4th Top 10 finishes (5)
- 6th NCAAT Appearances (19)
Seems like a decent basketball history to me, regardless of number of wins or SEC stats or head to head records.
- 3rd Top 25 finishes (15)
- 4th Top 10 finishes (5)
- 6th NCAAT Appearances (19)
Seems like a decent basketball history to me, regardless of number of wins or SEC stats or head to head records.
This post was edited on 3/28/16 at 2:18 pm
Posted on 3/28/16 at 2:19 pm to BHMKyle
quote:
Nope. Not at all. Not sure why you would try to put words in my mount about something when I've already posted by opinions about where all these programs rank within this very post.
Using a system ENTIRELY weighted on NCAA Tournament success, this is where those programs rnak all-time:
Kansas ranks #5
Michigan State ranks #8
UConn ranks #9
Florida ranks #26
Very few fans of basketball would disagree with those observations. But of course any true historian of basketball would know that its all about the NCAA tournament when it comes to college basketball.
UNLV ranks #4 in all-time basketball winning percentage.
Temple ranks #6 in all-time basketball total wins.
My rankings using only NCAA Tournament success ranks UNLV #30 all-time and Temple #32 all-time. Why because wins and winning percentage mean nothing if it hasn't translated in tournament success.
Your entire premise has been completely eviscerated in this thread on a handful of occasions, and basically every single time SOG hits "submit," but you're still typing up 3 page essays trying to backpedal around the fact that you had no idea Bama was ranked so highly in all time wins in all 3 major sports.
Posted on 3/28/16 at 2:20 pm to SummerOfGeorge
quote:
So, Alabama ranks SEC-wise :
- 3rd Top 25 finishes (15)
- 4th Top 10 finishes (5)
- 6th NCAAT Appearances (19)
Seems like a decent basketball history to me, regardless of number of wins or SEC stats or head to head records.
Fantastic work in this thread. Thanks for taking the time to compile all of those numbers.
Posted on 3/28/16 at 2:22 pm to SummerOfGeorge
quote:
Oh, that matters?
Well......
Total AP Poll Appearances Basketball
Wrong. As I stated before, football unfortunately has not historically had a true playoff system to go by. So for football, you have to use other measures.
As I previously stated, had football had an 8, 16, or even 32-team playoff for the past 60 years or so, all that would matter in the sport was playoff appearances and the success within those playoffs. Nothing else would matter. But football has never had such a system, unfortunately.
Because of that, we have to use other measures. AP poll performance is one of those.
But with that stated, even your method of using "appearances" in the AP poll is worthless. Who cares if a team appears 50 times at #25 if your team has appeared 40 times in the Top 10?
Secondly, who cares if teams are erroneously hyped in the preseason but do nothing during the year? FINAL rankings are the only AP rankings I go by. To use anything but final rankings is just stupid.
If you weight final rankings only.... Bama is ranked behind Kentucky, Arkansas, and Missouri.... and is one spot ahead of Florida.
But again, thankfully basketball gives us a purer measure: The NCAA Tournament. The AP poll means far more in football than basketball because there is no such measure in football.
Posted on 3/28/16 at 2:22 pm to BHMKyle
Are you honestly trying to hold the position that Georgia has had a better overall baseball history after what Summer of George posted showing how laughable that is? In case you didn't read it on the earlier page.
Let's start with the stats in UGA's favor:
CWS appearances:
UGA - 6
Bama - 5
Baseball national championship:
UGA - 1
Bama - 0 (includes 2 runner up finishes)
It's all Bama after that:
NCAA tourney appearances:
Bama - 23
UGA - 13
SEC championships:
Bama - 14
UGA - 7
SEC tourney titles:
Bama - 7
UGA - 0
Let me guess, you still have UGA as the better all time program?
Let's start with the stats in UGA's favor:
CWS appearances:
UGA - 6
Bama - 5
Baseball national championship:
UGA - 1
Bama - 0 (includes 2 runner up finishes)
It's all Bama after that:
NCAA tourney appearances:
Bama - 23
UGA - 13
SEC championships:
Bama - 14
UGA - 7
SEC tourney titles:
Bama - 7
UGA - 0
Let me guess, you still have UGA as the better all time program?
This post was edited on 3/28/16 at 2:25 pm
Posted on 3/28/16 at 2:25 pm to SummerOfGeorge
All-time wins is certainly an important category. But I will say post-season success is not only more important, but a lot more so. To prove my point I submit to you: LSU basketball 2015-2016. 4th in the SEC, with wins over #1 and #2, and 3.8 seconds away from a win over a top 10 team (Oklahoma). But pretty much every fan wants the coach fired and probably burned at the stake. Why? Because NO tourney.
Posted on 3/28/16 at 2:25 pm to Tuscaloosa
Alabama Basketball (SEC Rankings)
2nd SEC Tournament Championships
3rd SEC Championships
3rd AP Top 25 Finishes
4th AP Top 10 Finishes
4th NCAAT Sweet 16 Appearances
4th Overall SEC W/L % (61.4%)
6th NCAAT Appearances
We ain't Kentucky, but we have a solid history. And that doesn't include "total wins" or "head to head" which we also own most of outside of Kentucky.
2nd SEC Tournament Championships
3rd SEC Championships
3rd AP Top 25 Finishes
4th AP Top 10 Finishes
4th NCAAT Sweet 16 Appearances
4th Overall SEC W/L % (61.4%)
6th NCAAT Appearances
We ain't Kentucky, but we have a solid history. And that doesn't include "total wins" or "head to head" which we also own most of outside of Kentucky.
This post was edited on 3/28/16 at 2:28 pm
Posted on 3/28/16 at 2:25 pm to lsufball19
quote:
that's kind of a leap from what he's trying to say IMO.
Of course it was. LSU fans understand this because they don't have to stretch pointless measures to try to inflate their lack of success.
It also contradicted the very rankings I had posted earlier that measured only NCAA Tournament success.
... but thats the type of crap this poster has been reduced to.
Posted on 3/28/16 at 2:26 pm to PurpleandGeauld
quote:
Why? Because NO tourney.
Has more to do with the talent that was available and misused or underutilized, combined with the bad losses, IMO.
Posted on 3/28/16 at 2:27 pm to BHMKyle
quote:
Who cares if a team appears 50 times at #25 if your team has appeared 40 times in the Top 10?
quote:
FINAL rankings are the only AP rankings I go by. To use anything but final rankings is just stupid.
You should read down. The top 4-5 teams stay pretty much the same for Top 25, Top 10 appearances and appearances in the Final Top 10 and 25 (meaning you had a Top 10 or 25 season).
And you say the tournament is in place, the tournament only really determines the champion. The rest are equals of 64, 32, 16, 8, 4, 2.
This post was edited on 3/28/16 at 2:29 pm
Posted on 3/28/16 at 2:29 pm to Old Hellen Yeller
quote:
I had not realized how historically terrible UGA was in basketball.
Georgia fans are realistic. If we acted like Bama fans we'd point to our Final Four appearance and pretend it means far more than it does to try to inflate our all-time standing in the sport.
As I stated earlier, Georgia ranks around #11 all-time in basketball in the SEC... Bama is #7.
I'm sorry the vast majority of the bama fan base does not understand the concept of rationally measuring up your own team.
Posted on 3/28/16 at 2:30 pm to BHMKyle
quote:
Of course it was. LSU fans understand this because they don't have to stretch pointless measures to try to inflate their lack of success.
I don't have to stretch anything to factually state that Alabama is ranked #1 in all time wins in football, #1 in all time wins in baseball, and #3 in all time wins in basketball - and that we're the ONLY program in the SEC to rank in the top 3 of the conference in all 3 major sports.
But it is an incredible stretch to suggest all time wins flat out don't matter. In fact, that's one of the most absurd things I've ever heard - and it wasn't until you started backpedaling after you realized your original premise about "SEC wins" was wrong that you started using that argument.
I'm trying to give you the benefit of the doubt, but I'm beginning to have a really, really tough time doing so.
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